Talk:Bolognese sauce

Initial comments

I've marked this for cleanup as it seems to have been written by a fourteen year old. In particular the section on Spaghetti Bolognaise.. 88.110.36.228 17:33, 7 July 2006 (UTC)

I can't seriously believe that british students know how to make real ragu`... if they're inept at cooking, they're probably not doing ragu` right either.

• Don't be biashed :P -- SoothingR 21:36, 8 October 2005 (UTC)
• I'd suspect they're thinking more of the tomato based fake bolognese instant-sauce than the real thing. Making a proper ragout requires a little more expertise. — Ashmodai ^{(talk · contribs)} 06:37, 15 November 2006 (UTC)

Spaghetti bolognese is ancient, well-traveled and widely interpreted. Why on earth should this television chef Heston have a dedicated section to his own take on it? Clearly he's not making Spaghetti bolognese anymore if he's adding fish sauce, tarragon and Worcestershire sauce! Can this be replaced by a section on various interpretations of Spaghetti bolognese worldwide? More interesting and relevant than the silly ideas of one minor celeb from a non-food nation. Mahlzeitgeist (talk) 14:03, 22 January 2010 (UTC)

I'd agree with adding more interpretations, but frankly, I think you're trolling given your description of Blumenthal as a "minor celeb" and the UK as a "non-food nation". 19:02, 22 January 2010 (UTC)

I believe the section on Blumenthal's "version" has little relevance on this page. They are no more Bolognese sauce than vodka and grapefruit juice is a Screwdriver. (Tho his trick of adding star anise to deepen the meat flavor is kind of cool--I'm gonna steal that for other applications..) Recommend deleting.

--afn33282 4:02, 6 February 2010 (UTC)

I hardly think spaghetti bolognese has an ancient history, spaghetti is never used with a ragu (note ragu, not ragout).

Misconceptions

In the United States it can be hard to find authentic ragu bolognese. This leads to many misconceptions. Here are my comments:

For more information, the canonical reference on ragu bolognese is The Splendid Table by Lynne Rossetto Kasper.

It is not made from ground meat. The meat should be finely minced. This important difference has two consequences:

• The texture is different, and
• If the home cook buys pre-ground meat at the supermarket, it is likely to be too fatty and lead to a greasy ragu.

Certainly, one can use ground meat as a shortcut, but it should be recognized as such -- it really does make a big difference in the final product!

This is a meat sauce, not a tomato sauce. I'm not just trying to be pedantic here. The amount of tomato in authenic bolognese is very small: maybe a 1/4 cup of tomato sauce or a couple of tablespoons of tomato paste.

tilthouse 18:43, 14 November 2005 (UTC)

I have also removed the garlic since this is not present in the recipe: for a recipe very close to the tradition see the it:Ragù bolognese. --Biopresto 07:18, 30 March 2006 (UTC)

hmm as a british student i have to point out thats its spag bog not spag bol.

As an equally british person I would point out that I have NEVER heard the term Spag Bog but have frequentely heard it described as Spag Bol, in day to day life and in the media. CartmanUK26 13:27, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

Hmm... yes. I agree with CartmanUK26 (the latest in a long line of CartmanUKs). I didn't notice this discussion the other day when I created the section below. Oh well. --Dreaded Walrus 07:07, 16 March 2007 (UTC)

Have to agree as well, I've only ever heard spag bol. Spag bog sounds like a symptom suffered the next day if the spag bol was bad. eyeball226 (talk) 16:36, 1 May 2010 (UTC)

Ground beef versus minced beef

So what is the difference between ground beef and minced beef ? 198.144.208.148 02:28, 30 April 2006 (UTC)

Think about the difference between a hamburger patty from McDonnalds (barely resembling meat as it has been so pureed) and steak that has been fed through a mincer and extruded.

picture

Are there any other available pictures? I don't know many Italians who serve the dish without mixing the pasta and sauce together before serving it. I don't really know how to find applicable pictures without violating copyright laws, but someone must.

One day or the other I'll try to do a nice picture, I eat it very often, the point is to use a nice pot for a good looking picture. --Biopresto 18:55, 16 November 2006 (UTC)

How about this one?: http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bild:Fettuccine_al_rag%C3%B9_modified.JPG
-- ZZyXx 17:12, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

"Spag Bog"

The article mentioned that in the UK Spaghetti Bolognese "is known as Spag Bol or Spag Bog". I changed that to "is sometimes known as", as it is still usually known as Spaghetti Bolognese in my own experience. I also removed Spag Bog, as not only had I not heard of it, but it seems relatively uncommon when compared with "Spag Bol". --Dreaded Walrus 20:12, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Ola

---- I put spag bog back - it's definitely used a lot in the UK, from my geordie dad to my cockney mum.

It seems to have gone again in the interim, but I've restored spag bog as it is definitely idiomatic in the UK. Ericoides (talk) 10:29, 16 August 2009 (UTC)

Accademia Italiana della Cucina

The original recipe contains red wine, not white. 217.162.119.127 (talk) 00:48, 14 July 2008 (UTC)

deeling

kiohuhu —Preceding unsigned comment added by 124.188.4.190 (talk) 07:25, 2 February 2009 (UTC)

Which sort of wine?

The intro says the recipe traditionally uses red wine. The modern interpretations section says that white wine is traditionally used, not red. Which is it? --Irrevenant [ talk ] 00:09, 11 July 2009 (UTC)

Traditionally, red wine would go into the sauce, while white would be drank with the meal. Contemporarily, especially in North America, whatever the diner's preference is, is fine and often neither are put into the sauce when prepared. Consider though that the recipe did not originate in North America. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 204.244.212.5 (talk) 02:00, 25 November 2009 (UTC)

Inconsistent spelling

Which is the correct spelling, "spaghetti bolognese" or "spaghetti Bolognese"? That is what I wanted to find out from this article, but unfortunately it is inconsistent regarding the capitalization. 78.133.122.211 (talk) 09:43, 30 October 2009 (UTC)

As far as I can see, it's capitalised if it's referring to the traditional ragu, but lowercase if it's referring to the slop that you can buy in a jar :) Thedarxide (talk) 10:28, 30 October 2009 (UTC)

Actually the correct term is "[spaghetti] alla Bolognese" that means "the Bolognese way, referring to the city of Bologna in Emilia Romagna. In fact most pasta dishes are described in this fashion eg. spaghetti alla carbonara, bucatini all'Amatriciana, penne all'arrabbiata, and so on. In the case of the Bolognese sauce, the spelling requires a capital letter since in Italian names of cities and adjectives derived therefrom require a capital letter. Although one frequently, especially outside of Italy, comes across spaghetti or fettuccine alla Bolognese, this sauce is traditionally associated only with tagliatelle or lasagna. carlosdiz --Carlosdiz (talk) 03:24, 24 August 2011 (UTC) Carlosdiz (talk) 03:24, 24 August 2011 (UTC)

Australia / New Zealand Tuesday night spaghetti tradition

Can anyone cite any evidence of this "tradition" or is it just hearsay? I live in New Zealand and I have never heard any mention it. Even if it exists it must be relatively uncommon and probably not worth a mention in this article. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 202.126.194.81 (talk) 23:26, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

I live in australia and it caught my eye also, as I've never heard of anyone practicing this supposed tradition before in my life. 121.223.243.95 (talk) 07:32, 10 August 2010 (UTC)

Likewise. The only Tuesday tradition that I know about is Cheap Pizza Tuesday when the two main pizza chains drop their prices. --MichaelGG (talk) 14:33, 30 August 2010 (UTC)

I've lived in Australia for 20 years and I was introduced to this tradition by my grandmother. Since then, I've had spaghetti every possible Tuesday. So, that's some evidence. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 58.161.69.234 (talk) 09:27, 9 September 2010 (UTC)

I concur. This is an established practice in my family and among those I grew up with. I imagine scholastic evidence can be found without great difficulty. 203.213.105.179 (talk) 10:15, 21 September 2010 (UTC)

Belgian origin of Bolognese

In the late 70s I remember talking to an older "mama" (Italian mum) who had immigrated to Belgium in the early 50s. The lady was known as a formidable cook and an authority on Italian dishes & sauces.

She claimed it was a group of Italian immigrants living in Belgian coal mining region who invented the Bolognese sauce from ingredients they had lying around. The sauce was cheap, quick & easy to make, which is why it became quickly popular amongst the Italian immigrant population in Belgium, who later spread the cheap recipe among lots of other Italian mining immigrant families around the world. A few of the "original" cooks came from Bologna, and decided to dedicate the sauce because unlike Napolitana (Naples) & Romana (Rome) Bologna didn't have its own (signature) sauce at that time.

Problem is that the lady in question died about 15 years ago, none of this was written down and the story can only be corroborated by people who have known the lady and heard her stories (and tasted her food). —Preceding unsigned comment added by 91.177.73.74 (talk) 18:52, 23 September 2010 (UTC)

Sorry Sir, but the story is unreal! The "Ragù alla Bolognese" is not cheap, nor quick nor easy to make. Italians are great story tellers, expatriates particularly!

Contradiction

The article contradicts itself numerous times about the traditional ingredients mentioned by the Academia della Cucina. At one point it says one list of ingredients, but later, a recipe said to be from the same source lists a different set. Can someone who speaks Italian check what the Academia says and edit this please? 109.246.1.175 (talk) 21:36, 13 March 2011 (UTC)