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Requested move 2 August 2021

[edit]
The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: Not moved. Consensus is that nom’s concerns with the current title are shared but the proposed title is apparently not used in English reliable sources. (non-admin closure) В²C ☎ 07:02, 11 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Sichuanese people → Bashu people – The term Sichuanese People or 四川人, is ambiguous, and might cause confusion between "People of the Bashu Culture ,Heritage" and "People of Sichuan province". For example, people of Chongqing, that are included under this page, are part of the Bashu heritage and culture, and yet they are not apart of Sichuan province. A more neutral and accurate cultural term: Bashu is proposed, to clear the confusion, also to match the title 巴蜀人 of the Chinese wiki page and other informations. Source 1, "the oral stories, songs and performances that are passed on by generations of decendants of Bashu people"[1], Source2, "Zhuzi poem is popular among Bashu people with its characteristics of..."[2] Source3, "They can' resisit the bold and righteous folk customs of the Bashu people ..."[3] Source 4, "infuses the religious rituals of Buddhist statues with a lifestyle, ideal and desire of Bashu People[4] Source 5, "It's local diet practice of Bashu people's ..."[5] Source 6, "It was written by Chu or Bashu people..."[6] Carvesoda3789 (talk) 21:38, 2 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Carvesoda3789: You're going to have to provide at least one source that uses the term "Bashu people" before I can consider this. Also, the capitalization needs to be "Bashu people". Waiting for sources before !voting. User:力 (power~enwiki, π, ν) 03:00, 3 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]
@力: Sources added, please start voting — Preceding unsigned comment added by Carvesoda3789 (talk • contribs) 21:11, 5 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • I agree with the concerns of the nominator, but "Bashu" 巴蜀 referring to modern inhabitants is a bit of a neologism in both English and Chinese as Chongqing was only separated from Sichuan in 1997, hardly long enough to form deep cultural differences (the newish Bashu culture article notwithstanding). The issue is already dealt with in the intro. —  AjaxSmack  20:49, 8 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I agree with the nominator. The term “Bashu people” 巴蜀人 actually has a wide context of usage today. On the contrary, the term “Sichuanese” 四川人 is relatively recent, because it primarily refers to people from “Sichuan province”, which has different meanings in the 19th century, the early 20th century and today. Louisbasuria (talk) 22:13, 9 August 2021 (UTC) — Louisbasuria (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic. [reply]

I agree with the nominator that Bashu people are different from Sichuanese, and now there are many people who identify themself with Bashu.Its a much more accurate and neutral term. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Londnernedra123 (talk • contribs) 04:36, 10 August 2021 (UTC) — Londnernedra123 (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic. [reply]

  • I very much understand the concern of : @AjaxSmack: , however, the term "Bashu people"巴蜀人or simplified as蜀人 referring to local inhabitants was not uncommon, and was the official and most consistently used term in both official and social context throughout history until 20th century.[7][8][9] [10](On the other hand, as User:Louisbasuria mentioned, the term "Sichuan"四川 have always been purely a provincial term. The term "Sichuanese People"四川人 referring to the local inhabitants was not emerged until 20th century, and was not widely adopted until later half of the 20th century. Since the term "Bashu people"巴蜀人 as a term referring to people of Sichuan and Chongqing is already well accepted among it's original Chinese cultural context (Such as:the Chinese version of this page巴蜀人， and the page Bashu Culture）, once concerns are cleared, we shall also update our informations to the one of accuracy, instead of holding on to a familiar old one, which is already outdated in it's original context. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Carvesoda3789 (talk • contribs) 23:30, 9 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]
    • I notice your references are all in Chinese; we need English usage for an article title per WP:UE. I checked Google Books and found literally no references to the contemporary inhabitants of Sichuan and Chongqing as "Bashu People". In fact there are more references to the Bashu people of DR Congo and Cameroon than to anything related to China. Therefore...

References

  1. ^ Dong, Mei (2019). Study of Bashu Culture Based on Tang Poems and Their English Versions. Advances in Social Science, Education and Humanities Research, Volume 356 (Atlantis Press): 614. doi:https://doi.org/10.2991/cesses-19.2019.139 https://www.atlantis-press.com/proceedings/cesses-19/125920317. Retrieved 2021.8.2. {{cite journal}}: Check |doi= value (help); Check date values in: |access-date= (help); External link in |doi= (help); Missing or empty |title= (help); More than one of |pages= and |page= specified (help)
  2. ^ Wu, Wei (2017). "Dean of East China Normal University Mengxiancheng College". Primary Exploration of the Marriage Customs of Bashu Area Through Chengdu Zhuzhi Poem. 3 (Institute of Folklore, School of Social Development, East China Normal University. and Journal of Xichang University (Social Science Edition) 2017 3rd Edition): 71–76. Retrieved 2021.8.2. {{cite journal}}: Check date values in: |access-date= (help)
  3. ^ Tian, Zengpeng (2021.7.5). "Chain future, Shudao wine is not difficult". Seetao. Seetao News. Retrieved 2021.8.2. {{cite news}}: Check date values in: |access-date= and |date= (help)
  4. ^ Zhou, Qifeng (2019). "Exploring the Artistic Characteristics of Dazu Rock Carvings Statue Clothing": 27. Retrieved 2021.8.2. {{cite journal}}: Check date values in: |access-date= (help); Cite journal requires |journal= (help); More than one of |pages= and |page= specified (help)
  5. ^ Zhang, Qian (2018). "Research on the social and cultural value of the traditional production techniques of Pixian bean paste-on the application for cultural heritage of Chinese food". China Condiment 2018. Volume 43 No7 ISSN 1000-9973 Record Number: 20183311001 (Editorial Department of China Condiment): 188–192. Retrieved 2021.8.2. {{cite journal}}: |volume= has extra text (help); Check date values in: |access-date= (help)
  6. ^ Wei, Xiang (7-9-2019). "The Development of Shamanism and Its Social Functions in the Song Dynasty (960-1279):Taking Folktales in Record of the Listener as Major Examples" (Seton Hall University Dissertations and Theses): 1-77. Retrieved 2021.8.2. {{cite journal}}: Check date values in: |access-date= and |date= (help); Cite journal requires |journal= (help)
  7. ^ 司馬, 遷 (漢). 史記. {{cite book}}: Check date values in: |date= (help)
  8. ^ 方, 幹 (唐). 思江南. {{cite book}}: Check date values in: |date= (help)
  9. ^ 丁, 宝桢 (1870s). 四川鹽法志.
  10. ^ 黃, 延桂 (清). 《四庫全書，四川通志》. pp. https://ctext.org/wiki.pl?if=gb&res=559230&remap=gb. {{cite book}}: Check date values in: |date= (help)
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
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