Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/MacMahon family

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. Sandstein 06:51, 28 September 2019 (UTC)[reply]

MacMahon family

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This family has only one notable member: Patrice de MacMahon. One notable person does not make the whole family notable. — Mr. Guye (talk) (contribs) 01:23, 12 September 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Lists of people-related deletion discussions. — Mr. Guye (talk) (contribs) 01:23, 12 September 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of France-related deletion discussions. — Mr. Guye (talk) (contribs) 01:23, 12 September 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Ireland-related deletion discussions. — Mr. Guye (talk) (contribs) 01:23, 12 September 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Redlinks do not necessarily mean nonnotability. So on what basis do you claim there is only one notable entry? postdlf (talk) 02:31, 12 September 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Keep - Per postdlf, a lack of articles doesn't automatically mean a lack of notability. (Otherwise, if the project already has an article on everything that is, or ever will be, notable, then we might as well just disable the "create article" button :) ). Jokes and deliberate exaggerations aside, I would note that, while it is true to say that we currently only have an article on one MacMahon family member in the EN project (i.e there is only one member of the related/primary category in English), there are articles on multiple MacMahon family members in the FR project (i.e. there are about 10 members of the equivalent category in French). And it is perhaps unsurprising that the various holders of the titles of 'Marquis d'Éguilly' and 'Duc de Magenta' are better covered in the FR project. Per WP:WORLDVIEW. Anyway, while the sources in the article could certainly be bulked-up (to better establish notability of the subject/family as a whole), I don't think that "only one family member meets the criteria" is a viable argument for deletion. Guliolopez (talk) 09:15, 12 September 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Keep - as per Guliolopez. The article is clearly in need of development, but Irish families in possession of French marquisates are potentially of significant historical interest (cf. Lally-Tolendal) and the first Dr MacMahon is likely to have done something at least modestly notable in order to be ennobled by the French King (even if the article does not yet impart to us exactly what).45ossington (talk) 12:34, 12 September 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - members of a family cannot inherit notability from other members per WP:BIOFAMILY and WP:INVALIDBIO - this article also lacks significant coverage in multiple reliable secondary sources and so does not meet WP:BASIC or WP:ANYBIO - while individual members of the family might be notable, that does not mean that the whole family is notable - Epinoia (talk) 21:41, 18 September 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, North America¹⁰⁰⁰ 08:56, 20 September 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Keep. The family was listed in the Almanach de Gotha which I think means they are notable as a family. And as Guiliolopez says, just because some individuals are red links doesn't mean they always will be. The second Marquis was created a peer of France in 1827 so would meet WP:POLITICIAN, and he and his brother Maurice-François were both general officers so would meet WP:SOLDIER. Opera hat (talk) 10:40, 20 September 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Keep per Opera hat. If other reference works view the family as notable, wikipedia should too.4meter4 (talk) 01:25, 28 September 2019 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.