Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Miscellaneous/2007 September 10

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September 10

Church cook book

I found a church cook book titled "The Forget~Me~Not Club of St.James Church. The front of the book was gone, I have no idea how old it is, but some of the companies in Quincy were advertised...their phone number were 3-digit and 4-digit numbers. Some...have a letter after the number...example...Insure with HAUTER...LIFE-FIRE-AUTO

                                                 Telephones: Office  430 - Residence 3420-J
                                                 404 W.C.U. Building   Quincy.Illinois

Could you please help me as to where and how old this cook book might be? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.109.254.120 (talk) 00:05, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

You might try searching [http://www.antiqbook.com/boox/top/books61000.shtml ] [1] or you could write them at: [http://www.quincynet.com/explore/worship/ch053.htm ] —Preceding unsigned comment added by Barland1 (talk • contribs) 22:22, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

You could try contacting the phone company in Illinois, and ask if there is a historian on hand. I believe the letter after the number suggests a party line. --Mdwyer 03:54, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Our article on Telephone number explains the format of early phone numbering systems. Also, this document, from 1937, seems to use a similar format to what you described. Have you contacted the church to see if they have a church historian? 152.16.16.75 09:23, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Someone appears to be selling a copy of the same book in an eBay store, and lists its date as "Ca 1920??". You may be able to track down information about the book by contacting the Historical Society of Quincy and Adams County and the Quincy Public Library. The latter appears to own a microfilm of St. James Evangelical Lutheran Church records covering the years 1851-1962. - brian the librarian —Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.125.140.4 (talk) 20:30, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Eco-scam ?

I'm watching Sean Hannity's America, and they're claiming that the whole Environmental Movement is a scam, such as exposing Al Gore and the environmentalists as hypocrites. I was going to donate some $$$$ to Earthshare, but was told that this was a scam and that I'd be supporting terrorists like PETA, ALF, ELF, Earth First! and worse. Is it a good idea to donate $$$$ to Earthshare in view of this ?! Should the Hannity's America statements be incl. in any articles ? 65.173.105.79 01:28, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Wikipedia has an article on Hannity's America which gives some idea about the show's view.--Countincr ^{( t@lk )} 01:38, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

(comment removed- even though I disclaimed frantically not to give money to ecoterrorists I'm still uncomfortable with how my comments might be misinterpreted, sorry) --froth^t 03:52, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

(edit conflict)

See the Wikipedia policy on reliable sources. Hannity has a right to his opinion, but it's just his opinion, and it's his job to be a right-wing blowhard. Earthshare's list of member organizations does not include any ecoterrorist or radical groups. I always wonder at people who say the entire environmental movement is a scam. If I was interested in making money, I'd be much more likely to go to work for a big, polluting company than take a $11/hour job sending out flyers for the Rainforest Alliance. -- Mwalcoff 04:00, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

• If the environmental movement is a scam, I invite Mr. Hannity to eat a fish from my local stream. It might not have three eyes, but it will be loaded with PCBs from an electrical transformer factory that used the traditional "dump it in the creek out back" method of toxic waste disposal. The Sean Hannitys of the world's definition of "freedom" includes that company's freedom to pollute public streams, but not the rest of society's freedom to take their kid fishing. --Sean 13:43, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

• And PETA aren't terrorists. They campaign for the ehtical treatment of animals. I'm not saying the others are terrorist organisations, I've just never heard of them to comment (not being American).212.240.35.42 14:34, 10 September 2007 (UTC)
  • The ELF/ALF/EarthFirst types are labelled as terrorists because they sometimes do stupid things like property destruction in the name of their causes. They have an explicit policy of avoiding hurting anyone. I think it's stupid, counterproductive, and worthy of calling them vandals or criminals, but "terrorist" seems a bit much, considering that real terrorists tend to kill people. --Sean 17:26, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Wasn't there just something recently in the news about the top heads of non-profit organizations getting tons of money? So while I don't think it's a scam per se, some people probably are taking a percentage of the money for profit. --Wirbelwindヴィルヴェルヴィント (talk) 01:15, 13 September 2007 (UTC)

aaaargh and daaaaaang

I saw your messages above that linked to this site:

http://www.cs.unm.edu/%7Edlchao/flake/argh/index.html

frankly, I think it's massaging data, i mean how could human behavior be so simply modeled with a regression curve? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 12.217.199.246 (talk) 01:46, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Because people are predictable sheep? I don't see any reason to say that people are particularly difficult to model statistically in general, and his little experiment doesn't seem "massaged" --froth^t 04:03, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Roll one dice - and the number you get is random - all numbers appear equally. Roll 100 dice and add up the numbers on them and probability of each result will closely follow a standard bell-curve with most of the results adding up to 35 350 - very few adding up to 100 and very few adding up to 600. The randomness of a single dice is lost and a simple curve describes the most likely behavior. Similarly with people. The behavior of an individual is certainly too complex to model - but the average behavior of a large number of people may well follow some simple mathematical curve. SteveBaker 04:00, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

100 dice adding up to 35? And boy howdy you hit the nail on the head with my link to Asimov's psychohistory. --froth^t 04:05, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Oops! Slip of the finger. 350! Asimov's phychohistory is bunk though - while the behavior of a large number of people may well be predictable on a one-time basis (if someone sounds the fire alarm in an office building - most people will move towards the exits - but one or two will head back to pick up something from their desks first - this is predictable on a broad statistical basis), the nature of chaos theory means that Asimov's fictional account of it is a long way from being reasonable (if the one person who goes back happens to be the boss of the company - who is also a US presidential candidate - the consequences for society will be different than if it was one of the secretaries who returned. This is not predicatable from statistics). Phsychohistory is a great literary device to make a great story - but it's not remotely real! SteveBaker 12:54, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

How is this modeling human behavior in the first place? It is not the prediction of the likelihood of some response based on a certain stimulus; it is the # of hits on goolge and altavista for keyword searches. How can you be surprised to see such a nice regression when querying such a huge database? (noting how hard it is to conceptualize huge in this instance) Maybe it is predicting how people will spell dang when they have the desire to type it. I'm sure several factors would come into play: misspelling, emphasis, etc. The graph just represents how likely it is to be spelled a certain way with out respect to any of those.
Mrdeath5493 06:11, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

It's important to remember that "how likely" is distinct from "exactly how often" ... in this case it's the latter --froth^t 09:00, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

reminds me of the daaaaaang article where someone said that SteveBaker always over complicates things. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.240.69.176 (talk) 14:50, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Modeling phenomena without an underlying understanding of the forces, interactions, etc, is misleading. Kind of like astrology, which is based on modeling of visibility and movement of heavenly bodies with some characteristics of humans. What can you do with it(Sorry astrologers, using you as a whipping boy here). I think people have said, that we can model any thing with a sine-curve, but does that make it a plausible and predictable model? Aggregate thinking being ascribed to individual behaviour treats humans as a monolith, which we most definitely aren't. With the incredible data available, easy access to it, I hope we don't create our own version of astrology, a la, data based, but not vetted by science. Its one thing to say things are interesting, but we should caution people about techniques that can lead to spurious (or unproven) results. Fire away!! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.142.209.247 (talk) 16:35, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Large flocks of seagulls acting oddly

I live in central Canada, quite far away from any large bodies of water, and I've often seen large flocks of seagulls (over 100) circling for hours over a certain area of land where there would be a minimal chance of scavenging food. What would make them do this?

Also, I've seen other large flocks of gulls "migrating" (they were all flying in the same direction, in any case), but completely silently. Is this natural behavior?

205.200.133.133 01:52, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Go to Linda Moulton Howe's website and report this. Sounds bizarre to me. 65.173.105.79 02:04, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

(remember RD regulars, always AGF --froth^t 03:32, 10 September 2007 (UTC))

I have also seen this circling behavior and can confirm its validity (and strangeness). I live in Seattle and I have observed groups of, perhaps forty gulls, circling a false front on a clothing store near Pike Place Market. The birds did not appear to be feeding or engaging in mating behavior. They flow continuously in a clockwise direction and I watched them until my bus came (maybe half an hour). It was quite puzzling, especially by their almost precise repetitiveness. Perhaps the birds were sick in some way? If anybody has an idea about this I too would be very interested. --S.dedalus 06:12, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

If they weren't doing much flapping, they just would be riding a thermal. Easier and safer than hanging out together on the ground.--Shantavira|^{feed me} 08:19, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Yes, see our article Thermal. Also, while they are coasting around up there, they can keep an eye out for sources of food. Incidentally, if you take a look at Herring gull, you will see that these birds have adapted to life in inland cities. Also, they will migrate out of areas that experience cold winters (such as central Canada). Marco polo 19:57, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Yep, sounds like a thermal to me. They get a free ride and a free look-see out of it - possibly fun too. On the other hand, it wasn't flying ant day where you live, was it (or a 'whatever fat, flying bugs your have where you live emerging and swarming' day)? The gulls here circle en-masse and have a huge feast round here on that particular day of the year, plucking the ants out of the sky like they're going out of fashion. --Kurt Shaped Box 20:37, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Well, that seems to fit. Isn’t kind of odd to have a thermal so near a building though? Perhaps whatever heating or cooling systems they have on the roof was creating an updraft? --S.dedalus 22:14, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Might not necessarily be a 'thermal', as such. Wind hits building, wind is diverted up side of building and over? --Kurt Shaped Box 22:23, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Yes, here is a map of the location. The gulls were circling the entry way of Ross Dress for Less I believe. --S.dedalus 06:08, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

This is called 'slope lift' - I used to fly radio controlled gliders and we could chuck them into a good strong headwind on a steeply sloping hill and fly for hours using the lift caused by wind blowing up the hill. But get onto the other side of the hill and "Very Bad Things" would happen in the turbulent down-wash on the opposite slope! SteveBaker 20:34, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

Academic field nicknames?

Economics is known as "the dismal science". Are there any other academic fields with nicknames? - RedWordSmith 04:47, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

I've heard of physics referred to on a number of occasions as "the Queen of Sciences". --jjron 11:01, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

What about taxonomy being disparagingly and incorrectly called "stamp collecting". --jjron 11:07, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Actually, the exact quote is from Rutherford, and goes "All science is either physics or stamp collecting.". Laïka 11:23, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Gauss said "Mathematics is the queen of the sciences ..." - see Wikiquote. Gandalf61 11:09, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Where I studied, there was an inscription that stated "Mathematics is the queen and handmaiden of the sciences." A quick search seems to attribute this to Eric Temple Bell. --LarryMac | Talk 13:43, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

In the UK at least, geography is often compared to "colouring in" Capuchin 11:36, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Geography was traditionally a rowing degree. DuncanHill 11:40, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

I like the quote "If it moves, it's biology. If it reacts, it's chemistry. And if it doesn't work, its physics!" :) Exxolon 21:37, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Not academic ... but the sport of boxing is referred to as "the sweet science." (Joseph A. Spadaro 17:51, 11 September 2007 (UTC))

Introductory books about Australia and New Zealand

The local English-language bookstore has one or two compact, informative books in English about the US or Britain that could be digestible and interesting for somebody intending to study for half a year or longer in that nation, with chapters on the government, the sexes, class, immigration and ethnicity, youth, the mass media, sport, culture, etc. (One about Britain has the misleadingly grandiose title of British Civilization.) But nothing analogous for Australia or New Zealand, let alone both, was in stock. Web searches have got me nowhere. Nothing essayistic, theoretical or polemical, please; compactness and up-to-date-ness are musts, and organization into digestible chunks would be most welcome. I'd be very grateful for author/title combinations (or ISBNs) of a few options, which I'd then look up. -- Hoary 07:52, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Are the Lonely Planet or Rough Guide type books along the line of what you are after, or do you want something more academic? They are a good place to start. The Lonely Planet guides for example are quite thorough on many aspects of the country, pretty accurate, usually up to date, compact, and fairly cheap. They should be easy enough to find and have variety - for example there's one on Australia overall, plus I believe separate ones on each state if you want that extra detail. --jjron 11:21, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the reminder. Yes, I'm familiar with both series, though I haven't seen the Rough Guide to Australia. I presume that the LP guide to Australia will be accurate as it's an Australian production and has gone through a number of editions. But there are two problems: it's dismayingly fat, and the great majority of it is about (a) what to see and how to have fun in Australia, rather than (b) how the place ticks. (Oh, and the reviews at amazon.com suggest that it's a turkey.) There is something titled Australia - Culture Smart!: a quick guide to customs and etiquette, which sounds a bit shallow but promising. -- Hoary 14:57, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Having never been Down Under I can't comment on its accuracy, but Down Under by Bill Bryson is the sort of book I would take if I did go to Oz. DuncanHill 15:15, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Many libraries use the subject heading "Australia--Guidebooks" for travel guides on the region. You can see a representative sampling using the WorldCat national library catalog: [2] If you enter your zip code, it will show you holdings in your local libraries. --Bill Pardue, Arlington Heights Memorial Library [3] —Preceding unsigned comment added by Billahml (talk • contribs) 15:31, 10 September 2007 (UTC)--Billahml 15:33, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Thank you both for your comments, but but but I'm not after a guidebook, or something that's "easy reading" (though I might have to settle for the one or the other). Instead, I'm after something that's very informative, compact, and not too difficult. Here's the British model; it's marketed as an area studies "textbook". -- Hoary 06:48, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

Bryson is very entertaining (with a number of errors and exaggerations mind you), probably worth reading before you come, but not what Hoary's after. Sorry, can't think of anything to match that British book, but if you'd like me to look next time I visit some decent bookstores around Melbourne in a couple of week's time, drop me a note on my talk page. If you have any specific questions I'd be glad to help out where I can. --jjron 08:39, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

That's a very generous offer. I'll now hop over to your talk page. -- Hoary 11:21, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

Israeli footballers and Sabbath

Having settled down to watch the England-Israel Euro 2008 qualifier,I noticed it was starting at 5pm Saturday (well before sunset) which seemed rather odd. Would playing in a football match be considered 'work' on the Sabbath? Do Israeli league football matches take place on Saturday and if so would they have to move about to accommodate sunrise/sunset times? Lemon martini 10:56, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Interesting question. You might find these links interesting. Apparently professional football is mainly played on Saturdays in Israel. The Israel Cricket Association has a special cricket league for those who don't play on the Sabbath. — Matt Eason ^{(Talk • Contribs)} 11:33, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Plus, it's unreasonable to assume that all Israeli's are hard-core religious types. All sorts of services (electricity supply, airports, telephones) have to be kept running on Sundays - there are people working at these places throughout the country. SteveBaker 12:44, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

And by Sundays you mean Saturdays... ;) FiggyBee 07:04, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

Only about 13-24% (number vary based on criteria) of Israelis are religious. Also many religious people do not participate in professional sports at all (Haredim). Anyone who wouldn't play on shabbat wouldn't join the league in the first place, and while that may exclude a few religious players it is more worthwhile for the league to play on shabbat than to have a few more good players. But to answer you question, No, playing football is not technically considered work on shabbat. Nevertheless very few religious Jews and many traditional Jews would not play professional sports on shabbat. Jon513 14:18, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

Yes, the Israeli league matches are played on Sabbath. I believe that international matches played at home are not played on Sabbath, but I don't have a source for this and could be wrong. The majority of Israeli society is indeed secular, so this doesn't raise issues normally. However, I recall that when Avi Cohen, perhaps the first Israeli player to gain widespread fame, played on Yom Kippur (Day of Atonement) for his club, there was widespread condemnation in Israel, even in sections of the less/non Orthodox community. --Dweller 14:26, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

NOT A NEW QUESTION

DEARS, I asked a question on reference desk on 8th september and this question is present with a title "medical education in cuba" (article 5.4). I am very thankful to DAVID who made a favour upon mi by answering to this question. But I need much more informations. I request you to try to give mi as much informations as possible because it is very very important for mi. I dont know who has more information about this topic, if you know some one who can answer this question in a better way, plz get him attended to this question. I will be very thankful. thanks —Preceding unsigned comment added by 201.220.222.140 (talk) 12:45, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Earlier this year Venezuela began honoring Cuban medical degrees. There remains much doubt in the US regarding Cuban trained MDs. Many doctors fear that the education is skewed by the socialist/political rhetoric and that given limited access to resources their doctors are not trained properly. In general the feeling is that if you want to practice to medicine in a under-developed nation, a Cuban medical degree may be right for you. If you want to practice in the US, you should probably consider other options.
Librarians - Ask us, we answer.
Find your local library at: http://lists.webjunction.org/libweb/Public_main.html Ktg2 14:00, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

I always thought that Cuban medicine and, by extension, Cuban doctors, where pioneering and used world leading technology? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.41.139.85 (talk) 03:35, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

And you believed that Cuba is a haven of social equality and freedom of speech as well, I suspect. It depends on your definitions of "pioneering" and "world leading" but it is hard to think of a single Cuban innovation or discovery adopted by the rest of the medical world since 1960. alteripse 03:50, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

hey, no-one likes a smartass mate. Judging by Healthcare in Cuba they do ok, esp considering US embargoes... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.41.139.85 (talk) 04:47, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

rave

I'm wondering how raves get started and people are invited to them. It seems like if you just told your fellow ravers, the cops would eventually get wind of it and raid the rave. How does this work? --MKnight9989 14:45, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

• There are usually postcards and flyers in head shops and attached to utility poles. Raves are not in themselves illegal (in most places). There are many places where fairly harmless illegal activity takes place and the police only occasionally bother to investigate (bars popular with underage drinkers, crackhouses that the neighbors aren't complaining about, law offices that pad their billable hours, etc.). Police involvement usually follows a complaint, not individual initiative. --Sean 17:32, 10 September 2007 (UTC)
• Answering the first part: they're generally started by a promoter who will rent a space for them, arrange for the music setup, advertise, etc., and then charge admission to make back his/her investment. --Sean 17:34, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Thanks. --MKnight9989 13:38, 12 September 2007 (UTC)

De ja vu

Hi! Anywho... I just read the article on deja vu and then looked at the discussion which told me to go here instead of posting there. I had a deja vu last night whilst i was eating chicken pie and my brother was talking about some star wars stuff. The week before i was playing warhawk and i had one. The article said " formal studies 70% of people report having experienced it at least once". So does anyone else think its wierd except formal studies and my mum??

Thanks helpful wikipedian guys. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.240.69.176 (talk) 14:47, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

This desk isn't for opinions especially, but I've had De ja Vu many times, I thought it was just me. Until a friend said "Whoa I just had a da ja vu" and I thought "What?". I always assumed it meant something posh or extravagant like "You think your're to good for public school? Well de ja vu!". ::Manors:: 16:51, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

I have never had it; I had no idea the numbers were so high. o_o Now I have to interrogate my family and friends, because none of them have ever mentioned it either. --Masamage ♫ 18:50, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

The important thing to remember is that the strange thing is NOT that the exact same thing happened to you twice (it probably didn't) - it's that your brain is (for some weird reason) telling you that this exact thing happened to you before when that is clearly not the case. Plenty of people have reported deja vue events that could not possibly be repeated. SteveBaker 19:41, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

I've had both "kinds": something really does happen twice despite astronomical chances against it, or it's just a trick of the mind and it had never happened before. I get the feeling a lot during dreams for some reason. --froth^t 22:31, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

De ja vu

Hi! Anywho... I just read the article on deja vu and then looked at the discussion which told me to go here instead of posting there. I had a deja vu last night whilst i was eating chicken pie and my brother was talking about some star wars stuff. The week before i was playing warhawk and i had one. The article said " formal studies 70% of people report having experienced it at least once". So does anyone else think its wierd except formal studies and my mum??

Thanks helpful wikipedian guys. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.240.69.176 (talk) 14:47, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

This desk isn't for opinions especially, but I've had De ja Vu many times, I thought it was just me. Until a friend said "Whoa I just had a da ja vu" and I thought "What?". I always assumed it meant something posh or extravagant like "You think your're to good for public school? Well de ja vu!". ::Manors:: 16:51, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

I have never had it; I had no idea the numbers were so high. o_o Now I have to interrogate my family and friends, because none of them have ever mentioned it either. --Masamage ♫ 18:50, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

The important thing to remember is that the strange thing is NOT that the exact same thing happened to you twice (it probably didn't) - it's that your brain is (for some weird reason) telling you that this exact thing happened to you before when that is clearly not the case. Plenty of people have reported deja vue events that could not possibly be repeated. SteveBaker 19:41, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

I've had both "kinds": something really does happen twice despite astronomical chances against it, or it's just a trick of the mind and it had never happened before. I get the feeling a lot during dreams for some reason. --froth^t 22:31, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Hehe... Lemon martini 14:59, 11 September 2007 (UTC) 14:57, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

cosmic hehe. Gzuckier 16:25, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

"It's deja vu all over again"Yogi Berra,hotclaws 17:18, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

just realised you guys had copied my question, now that is funny. We could do with a barnstar over here!! 89.243.21.81 06:35, 12 September 2007 (UTC)

		The Barnstar of Good Humor
		I agree with 89.243.21.81, It deserves a Barnstar! Wow, that's two barnstars awarded to two threads in just two weeks. Funny (^_^) --PolarWolf 23:32, 12 September 2007 (UTC)

Haven't I seen this barnstar somewhere before ...? -- JackofOz 23:42, 12 September 2007 (UTC)

I'm pretty sure this had been done before in yet another déjà vu question... --antilived^{T | C | G} 09:11, 13 September 2007 (UTC)

Yes, this was done before. I think you saw a barnstar like this on that question "daaaaaang", but oh well (I actually mentioned that in the barnstar- "two barnstars for two threads in just two weeks") --PolarWolf 22:17, 13 September 2007 (UTC)

Who is Matha Amrithananthamayi

would like to know more...pls help —Preceding unsigned comment added by 202.164.130.111 (talk) 15:49, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

I haven't been able to find much online, but she appears to be a spiritual and humanitarian leader from Kerala. DuncanHill 16:00, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Same here, I guess she isn't especially popular. Good name though. ::Manors:: 16:46, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

2 Millionth Article

Does anyone know the exact date / time of the 2 millionth Wiki article? Not to mention, the title? Also, where / how would I go about finding that info on my own, if I did not come to this Ref Desk for help? Thanks. (Joseph A. Spadaro 18:35, 10 September 2007 (UTC))

I found it by looking at Wikipedia:Two-million pool. Tentatively credited is El Hormiguero, at 4:21 UTC on September 9, 2007. Someoneinmyheadbutit'snotme 19:35, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Quadratic formula

How do i show that this: $x={\frac {-3\pm {\sqrt {(5^{2})-4x-3x2}}}{2x3}}$ = two thirds or minus five thirds —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.36.182.217 (talk) 19:22, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Suggestion 1 -- move over to the Math Help Desk at Wikipedia:Reference desk/Mathematics. You are certainly more likely to fare better there than here. (Joseph A. Spadaro 19:24, 10 September 2007 (UTC))

• sorry i thought WP:RD/M redirected to the maths reference desk —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.36.182.217 (talk) 19:27, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

No, that's WP:RDM!--Shantavira|^{feed me} 07:53, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

PS3 wikipedia

Hi guy, I'm using my ps3 to write and review questions but its made much more difficult by the fact that i can only read 3 words a line due to bad text wrapping can an admin fix this or do i demand too much... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.243.21.81 (talk) 19:40, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Anyone can do most anything on wikipedia, not just admins! A bunch of plain text and <h3> tags date back to the beginnings of the WWW; if your PS3 is having problems displaying it then chances are you'll have similar problems with almost every other website. Can you be more specific about your problem? --froth^t 22:34, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Yeah, sounds like a problem in the PS3's browser, not the site. If the PS3 can't do anything correctly with style sheets, and doesn't know when to ignore them, then it really can't be helped on this end. --72.83.173.248 00:54, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

Its not a problem with the PS3, because my friends looks the same and changing the font size or any other options does nothing. Surely I can't be the only person that goes on wiki on their PS3? Any way i would do it myself but my coding knowledge is limited mainly to games. Like I said it makes the wiki main page really big, for instnace the what happened on this day thing looks like this

On this day

some guy

did

something

and it was

recorded

on

wikipedia.

It also has the same effect with the synopsis of an article when it has a "this article may contain original research" warning box. It's really spoiling my wiki experience... any help would be muched appreciated. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.243.21.81 (talk) 18:51, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

Does anyone know which browser the PS-3 uses? It's surely not something custom-written for the thing? You could always install Linux for PlayStation 3 and presumably you could then use one of the mainstream browsers - FireFox for example. SteveBaker 03:25, 12 September 2007 (UTC)

I will have i look tonight on my PSP (i started this thread, but it says my IP has changed so i better start loggin in more). I think they are the same or at least based on one another. I looked at my PS3's browser before coming into school but there was no page or option that displayed "Browser made by x" or "X web browser for PS3". I went on to the PS3 portal today and signed up so I might try asking there. The links on my user page if anyone is interested. Nebuchandezzar 08:40, 12 September 2007 (UTC)

I am so sad that before I tried any games on my new PSP this past weekend, I opened Wikipedia in my PSP. The PSP doesn't have that problem of bad wrapping, but it does clutter the tabs and the login stuff, so it makes it hard to login. --Wirbelwindヴィルヴェルヴィント (talk) 01:09, 13 September 2007 (UTC)

Hmmm - according to our articles on the PS3 and the PSP, they both use the NetFront browser by Access Co - which is also used on a bunch of mobile phones and other teeny-tiny setups. It is known to have quite a few rendering problems - so I'm not entirely surprised that it's breaking. SteveBaker 13:34, 13 September 2007 (UTC)

Recyclable?

Are the lids to jam jars, salsa jars, etc. recyclable? They seem to be some kind of metal, but they're weird and coated, so I'm not sure. --Masamage ♫ 22:56, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Yes. Most food tins have plastic coatings, little different from those found on the lids of jars. I presume it all gets burnt off when the things get melted. --Tagishsimon (talk) 23:42, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Hm, okay. Thank you! --Masamage ♫ 06:11, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

• But don't forget the "reuse" part of conservation. If you start thinking of your purchases as "food, plus a free jar!", you'll never have to buy a container again. --Sean 13:56, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

There's a point where you just have too many jars, or the jar isn't very good for holding things (tabasco sauce, anyone?). --Wirbelwindヴィルヴェルヴィント (talk) 01:07, 13 September 2007 (UTC)

Well everything is recyclable to some degree it is just a question of whether an entity finds it cost-effective to do so. Check with your local recycling agency. I know my municipal recycling doesn't accept some specific things that are otherwise marked recyclable. -- Diletante —Preceding unsigned comment added by Diletante (talk • contribs) 16:25, 13 September 2007 (UTC)

Biology Display

I'm doing a display board for a biology class and need to choose a topic. The topic should be interesting for passer-byers, i.e. lots of pictures and colour. The topic choice is extremely broad and anything that has a slight amount of relation with biology is acceptable, such as genetic disorders, animals, plants, etc... What would guys recommend? Thanks. Acceptable 23:52, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

A lot depends on what grade-level you are and how broad or narrow of a topic is allowed. But I will tell you the first idea that came to my mind — other people can input what they think and you will have to choose one. My idea is, a comparison of flora and fauna in two parts of the world which have different climates. You could say, "Location A is is warm and wet, and it has these animals and these plants. By contrast, with cold dry weather, Location B has different types of animals and plants such as these." Maybe in the middle you could put the life forms that are similar in both areas, even with different weather. — Michael J 02:57, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

Effects of psychoactive drugs on humans and animals? --froth^t 03:38, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

I would make a life-size papier mâché replica of the Corpse Flower, with information about it on the display board. You could have a little jar with a dead mouse in it that people can sniff to see what it smells like. You'll totally win the science fair with that! --Sean 13:50, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

Poisonous plants and animals,always interesting and usefulhotclaws 17:21, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

How about optical illusions and what they can tell us about how our visual perception works? Examples always grab people's attention and they want to know how they work.--Eriastrum 21:05, 12 September 2007 (UTC)

Camouflage and natural pigmentation is always interesting, as is parasitism. Rockpocket 06:32, 13 September 2007 (UTC)